Firstly, the more difficult questions of OT. Author Paul Copan puts the OT in Ancient Near-Eastern context to begin with, which is a good start.
I reckon, as an example, when we wonder if it was a good thing to test if Abraham would kill his son, we have to remember that child sacrifice was practised by many ANE societies. So in context, God is saying that he demands the same commitment as other gods, but that child sacrifice is not required. So far from being an example of God being unpleasant, this is an example of how God is different, morally superior to what people at that time expected.
This is indeed how Copan deals with much problematic scripture. We have to see it in the context of the other civilisations of the time and their pervading moralities - which were generally much worse places to live. We have examples of other law codes from the time, which compare very unfavourably with the law of Moses. Tom Wright is quoted as saying that Mosaic Law is only temporary anyway - meant for a band of travellers in the wilderness. (sounds like the church).
Copan says we shouldn't necessarily judge ANE societies by our own moral standards. Maybe our morality is deficient in some way. (highly likely)
A corollary of this is that we are making moral Progress (or at least some of us are). Postmillennialism makes more and more sense. Almost as much as amillennialism. But that doesn't make either of them right.
Disappointingly, Copan doesn't ultimately have a good answer for why God seems to command massacres of Canaanites etc. He says that the Canaanites deserved it, God gave them plenty of time to repent, they actually weren't all wiped out anyway, God judged Israel even more harshly, etc.
If your ok with God commanding massacres under certain circumstances, that's fine, and there is other useful material in the book. I'm not, but I've got my wooly liberal cardigan on tonight and wonder about some of those texts.
Oh dear, run out of spac...
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Isaiah 19:23-25 New King James Version (NKJV)
23 In that day there will be a highway from Egypt to Assyria, and the Assyrian will come into Egypt and the Egyptian into Assyria, and the Egyptians will serve with the Assyrians.
24 In that day Israel will be one of three with Egypt and Assyria—a blessing in the midst of the land, 25 whom the LORD of hosts shall bless, saying, “Blessed is Egypt My people, and Assyria the work of My hands, and Israel My inheritance.”
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ReplyDeleteHi!
ReplyDeleteThere is one point which you never hear Dawkins make, nor any other atheist, but shockingly Christians never make it in defence and yet it is crucial: Our interpretation of the Old Testament is (should be!) very different to the literal interpretation which Jews, Muslims and atheists have. We (should!) always look at it in light of what Jesus revealed. This is not what scholars tend to do because they often want to see what it 'originally' meant but the distinction should be made that we see things differently now. We see Jesus in Abraham's son... taking your example as my example!
Yes, we should read in historical context as you point out - and this certainly helps - but let's not forget the impact of Jesus on our interpretations. See 1Corintians 10.
The OT is God's word but without the interpretation which Jesus and his apostles applied to it, the question is "are we reading it properly?". Does a literal reading always give us God's word? No: We are not Jewish or Muslim or Atheist - we need the context of God's love as revealed in Jesus.
Yes I quite agree we need to be people of the New Testament. I suppose the objection that could be made is one of inconsistency - why is the God of the OT seemingly unlike Jesus? Not that I've heard that often.
ReplyDeleteI seem to remember in "The God Delusion" there's a rant about the OT, and then he says something like, "but Christians would say, that's all very well but what about Jesus?"( Perhaps the sharpest point in the book!) But then, disappointingly, he doesn't really address the issue at all.
Dawkins won't address the issue because if it was an issue he truly grasped, he wouldn't be writing his books! :-)
ReplyDeleteI'm surprised you rarely hear concerns about the OT God and NT Jesus seeming so different. I think that is because people learn what not to talk about in church!
If somebody objects that the God of the OT is unlike Jesus, I say something like -
The OT by itself is like looking with earth-focused eyes and ctaching glimpses of God's revelation of what is beyond. When 'God said' things, we are seeing what ancient people believed God was teaching them at the time. This is not a perfect revelation of what God says... something major is missing...
until...
Jesus arrives! The light of the Gospel is switched on!
Jesus makes the blind see and we can look afresh at the OT as Paul and the Gospel writers did, as Jesus shows the disciples to do on the road to Emmaus (Luke 24).
So look again at the OT. See Jesus in it. See the kingdom of God (heaven) rather than an earth-based sugar puff land of milk and honey. See the spiritual/heavenly first and then apply it to things on earth.
(Seek first the kingdom of God)
Let's apply this to the OT massacres which are so often a problem...
Where people saw God figthing, he was removing those who prevented his people from entering the promised land. We should see our Christian war as being against the spirits in the heavenly realms (as Paul teaches). The OT picture tells us to remove every thing that is in the way. This matches the NT 'if your eye causes you to sin' etc... but not physically as in the OT else Christians would have no eyes, hands or feet!
So I believe the 'inconsistency' between OT and NT God is actually due to our need to 'see' the OT from a NT stance. And btw the Gospels are themselves packed full of re-interpretation of OT narrative in light of Jesus.
... That's the sort of response I'd give Richard Dawkins. And then I'd invite him to comment on it in his next book!